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Biggest Losers?


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#1 NOOSEBLEEDS

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 05:46 AM

Sweden players has lost over 30 million usd.

Rich countries have the worst online poker players.

Sweden is one of the 10 countries that stands for 82% of the total online poker loss.

This According to an analysis made by the german website Pokerolymp.

The analysis shows the higher (gdp/income per inhabitant)A country have,The higer loss has

average online poker player.

The relation beetwen economical prospierity and the results in onlinepoker have been examine and the worlds richest countries is therfore the biggest losers.

Sweden is the 54:th best nation in the World with an average loss at heavy 9 dollar per 100 dollars betted.

Our Nordic Neighbors Norway and denmark dont have any flattering numbers either.

Players from Norway have an average loss for 10usd/100 dollar bet And the players from Denmark are even worse with net loss at 12 dollars/ 100 dollars bet.Finland net Loss average 1dollar /100 bet.

Pokercrazy Malta are one of the countries thats in top of the winning list.

Players from Malta have an average net win At 14 dollars/100 dollars bet.One Reason for this is probably because many pros lives on the island.

the basis for the statistics is collected from the sites Party poker and fulltilt,with start from year 2009.

Statistics shows that players from USA is the number one losing players with a total loss of 367 million dollars .

And sweden are at 9:th place with 34 mill dollar loss.

The whole research is here must read.http://www.pokerolymp.com/articles/show/keine/12786/comparison-poker-winnings-vs-gdp

This is my poor translate from a swedish newspapper. Feel free to correct me.

I found this article quit intresting. Any thoughts?



#2 NOOSEBLEEDS

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 06:09 AM

Rank

Country$/100GDPPlayersNet winnings in $
1. United States-8,0346.500865.843-367.950.000
2. Canada-10,6146.250194.344-122.220.000
3. Germany-4,6039.750221.099-96.520.000
4. United Kingdom-7,8536.250153.516-63.110.000
5. Netherlands-8,8447.00074.804-43.290.000
6. Australia-12,5857.00069.942-42.950.000
7. France-12,1239.50078.791-40.300.000
8. Sweden-9,2049.00046.960-33.830.000
9. Denmark-12,6355.75051.205-31.900.000
10. Russia-1,7110.250164.005-30.940.000
11. Switzerland-15,7969.00025.103-22.390.000
12. Italy-12,9234.00035.098-19.360.000
13. Norway-10,6084.50027.784-18.360.000
14. Belgium-11,3843.75029.322-17.930.000
15. Austria-8,3045.25025.235-16.240.000



#3 RunAwesome

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 07:12 AM

Am I missing something, how can this be right?
The US is -$368 mil, but there is no winning country with more than 3 million in profits, how does that work? Surely it can't be raked in that much, where does it go?

#4 NOOSEBLEEDS

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 07:23 AM

Maybe its to small sample. OR fulltilt rake kills, House always win but you dont belive it in playervsplayer game. or they count black friday as a loss :-)

Probably to few winning players in each and every country to cover for all the losing players.

#5 NOOSEBLEEDS

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 09:00 AM

http://www.pokerolymp.com/picture/resized/580/37532.jpg?1354713360Horizontal axis: average win rate for players of a country (in $/100); Vertical axis: GDP per capita for the country (in $); trendline

This chart shows first and foremost that almost all countries lose money on average, which was to be expected due to the rake. The few countries which show a positive win rate all have a GDP of less than $15.000 per capita.

#6 NOOSEBLEEDS

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 09:30 AM

NOOSEBLEEDS (2013-01-06) 

http://www.pokerolymp.com/picture/resized/580/37532.jpg?1354713360Horizontal axis: average win rate for players of a country (in $/100); Vertical axis: GDP per capita for the country (in $); trendline

This chart shows first and foremost that almost all countries lose money on average, which was to be expected due to the rake. The few countries which show a positive win rate all have a GDP of less than $15.000 per capita.

If the rake killing us maybe we all should join a own poker society and when we hit 100.000 members we negotiate for the rake else we all stop playing for while on that site.:-)

#7 fisher1414

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 10:16 AM

rake might not stop every single player from winningbut in a huge sample, of lets say millions of players the rake and losing players are going to highly overweight the winning players amount

#8 justforthat

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 05:28 PM

RunAwesome (2013-01-06) Am I missing something, how can this be right?
The US is -$368 mil, but there is no winning country with more than 3 million in profits, how does that work? Surely it can't be raked in that much, where does it go?


raked in that much.

#9 Wasiebassie

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 07:09 PM

The numbers for losing money can't be right because from what is this ? cashgames ? Mtts ? Sngs ? Imo this numbers are totally inacurate.

#10 RunAwesome

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 08:33 PM

justforthat (2013-01-06) 

RunAwesome (2013-01-06) Am I missing something, how can this be right?
The US is -$368 mil, but there is no winning country with more than 3 million in profits, how does that work? Surely it can't be raked in that much, where does it go?


raked in that much.

I assume that is just random guessing/speculation? Or is it based on statistics?

#11 dionyss

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 08:46 PM

Conclusion: all the monies go to Finnish players. And to the rake monster.

#12 Takahashi

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 07:24 AM

Isildur stats until yesterday: Total: -$117,221 (386569 hands).

I don't know the rake at his stakes, but if its $1,50 pr hand he has paid $579 853 in rake.... (before sponsor deals etc, it will still show as a loss in the tracking?)


I guess he is the most active player of all HS regs, but an insane rake to pay... lol

#13 RunAwesome

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 01:09 PM

Takahashi (2013-01-07) Isildur stats until yesterday: Total: -$117,221 (386569 hands).

I don't know the rake at his stakes, but if its $1,50 pr hand he has paid $579 853 in rake.... (before sponsor deals etc, it will still show as a loss in the tracking?)


I guess he is the most active player of all HS regs, but an insane rake to pay... lol



Not even close. Firstly a lot of the heads up tables cap the rake at $0.50.
Secondly you are assuming that every single hand he plays goes to a showdown. Hands that are won pre-flop are not raked. And then there are hands that he isn't involved in (folds pre-flop) at 6-max tables, which he wouldn't pay rake for either.

#14 atisz

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 01:43 PM

RunAwesome (2013-01-06) Am I missing something, how can this be right?
The US is -$368 mil, but there is no winning country with more than 3 million in profits, how does that work? Surely it can't be raked in that much, where does it go?




I think it's highly possible it goes to the house. Just imagine, all the Full Tilt leaders took out at least 50 million from the company. Bitar, Lederer, Ferguson, Ivey, and all the "smaller" names from Antonius to the unknown red pros. Their salary combined easily goes up to hundreds of millions.


Quote from this Forbes article on PokerStars

PokerStars quickly became the biggest firm in the world’s most important market and now has estimated annual revenue of $1.4 billion and some $500 million in profits.



#15 maldin

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 04:04 PM

Only 1-5%(prob closer to 1%) of poker players can do it beating the rake.

Just for an example yesterday I managed to win around 200$ in PLO100 and Fixed holdem 2/4 but I paid rake more or less 240$(as I got 60$ back from points over betfair). I played about 4-5 hours so I paid an hourly rake of 50-60$.

I claim that house and very few players actually profit from online poker.

That's the reason losers list is so much deeper than winners.

Most likely however they haven't considered rake backs in these calculations so for example Finlands -1$ might actually be slightly positive figure.

#16 Takahashi

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 06:38 PM

RunAwesome (2013-01-07) 

Takahashi (2013-01-07) Isildur stats until yesterday: Total: -$117,221 (386569 hands).

I don't know the rake at his stakes, but if its $1,50 pr hand he has paid $579 853 in rake.... (before sponsor deals etc, it will still show as a loss in the tracking?)


I guess he is the most active player of all HS regs, but an insane rake to pay... lol



Not even close. Firstly a lot of the heads up tables cap the rake at $0.50.
Secondly you are assuming that every single hand he plays goes to a showdown. Hands that are won pre-flop are not raked. And then there are hands that he isn't involved in (folds pre-flop) at 6-max tables, which he wouldn't pay rake for either.



My example had the wrong numbers, but it was only on Full Tilt... He played a few hands in Pokerstars too: Total: -$1,201,205 (682744 hands).
111,069,313 hands gives 100k + rake with $0,10 average rake. Plus all his hands in the Euro sites of course...




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